ProWrestling Fans WWE TNA Forum

Go Back   ProWrestling Fans WWE TNA Forum > Non-Wrestling > Off-Topic > Meeting Of The Minds

Meeting Of The Minds For Intelligent Conversations Only!

The issue of racism or why whites don't get it.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 15 Jun 2005, 05:32 PM   #1 (permalink)
Master Sergeant
 
The Glue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Pushing toward Visari Square...
Posts: 14,508
Rep Power: 6464
The Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DC
Default The issue of racism or why whites don't get it.

First and foremost I want to say that I am not taking a shot at KK here. However, something he said struck a chord with me, although it is the exact opposite of the chord he may or may not have intended to strike.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Double K
Maybe if people would start realizing that many of us (and i am speaking of myself as a typical white male in the US) have grown up beyond the 60's , beyond slavery, and having been raised to believe that white and black people (as well as other colors) are equal, we dont sit around griping about being treated as unequal. Now dont get me wrong, i know there are racist whites still out there, but guess what, there are racist blacks too, and racists of other color as well. But if i live my life trying to treat everyone as an equal, i will be damned if i am going to allow myself to be grouped into the mythological white american male KKK holding the black man down group that people want to believe we all are.
Yes. We grew up beyond slavery and segregation. We did not however, grow up beyond the lasting effects of those. Seeing as how the Civil War ended in the late 1800s you've got to figure that we're about a century and a quarter removed from the alleged "end of slavery." Fine.

However due to not receiving any formal "Americanized" education or training over and above what was called upon by their "slave occupation," most of the slaves that were freed by the events set in place by the Civil War, went right back to work for the slave owners who had to free them...only for mere pennies and not for free.

Needless to say that those people never really accumulated enough money to put themselves in a position of upward mobility. They weren't in a position to buy decent housing or clothing, much less to establish any savings for their childrens' education. Not that it would've mattered as slavery simply became "working for pennies" and segregation made sure that black people were not allowed the breadth of opportunities white people were.

The Civil Rights Movement didn't really pick up national momentum until the 60s. The Civil War ended in the 1880s. So it took black people 80 years just to put themselves in a position to affect a change with regard to which freaking bathrooms they could use in public. So try to hazzard a guess as to how far the black population had progressed as far as jobs, wages and housing?? Any realistic guess would suggest that while strides certainly would have been made in that regard, certainly the majority of black people in America were not at all where they should've been in a "Free America."

So let's move forward. It wasn't until the 80s that racial discrimination began to be actively stamped out. TV Shows and movies stopped using the "N" word without a care (anyone who remembers late 70s and early 80s TV and movies should remember that word was thrown around often and without regard), colleges and businesses were instructed to implement "racial quotas" for admission and employment, something that just about every white college student bemoans to this day. It was in the 80s that an equal footing was finally prevalent for minorities in America.

Of course, so many black people up to that point had been the victim of discrimination with regard to employment and/or enrollment in colleges that while "equal footing" certainly was available...not a majority of black people had able to acquire the educational qualifications and/or job experience to take advantage of that. I mean come on...without a Bachelor's Degree or a specialized aptitude, it's not easy to make the kind of money it takes to own a home, raise a family, send kids to college, etc. Less than 20 years removed from the de segregation of schools, how far do you think the country actually came?? Not very.

So those are lasting effects of slavery and segregation, but that's not even what I'm talking about when I talk about racism in America today. Of course you have the white woman who shudders and clutches her purse to her chest when a black man gets into an elevator with her...you've got the security guards that follow black kids around the malls...etc etc. These are of course racist annoyances, but I've come across several examples of racism that affects people more deeply than that. Because I've gone on forever, I'll keep it to one and forgive me if I've shared this with you before.

I work with a wonderful woman who I shall refer to as Londa. I don't say this to further my point, rather I say it because it's true, she is one of the sweetest, most pleasant people I have ever met. She once called me her "pigmentally challenged brother," and that's really just an example of how great she is. She has literally no problem with anyone until they wrong her.

Well one day at a gas station in the inner part of the city we live in, she was attacked by another woman who had a straight razor or knife, I'm not sure which. Londa in no way provoked the attack, as I recall this was a girlfriend of an ex boyfriend of hers that she hadn't given a rat's ass about for quite some time. Police arrived on scene and arrested both Londa and the bitch who attacked her, despite five people telling the arresting officers that Londa in no way provoked, incited or even addressed the woman until the attack began. In a court of law, eyewitness testimony from three people is considered credible evidence. Five people told the cops that she didn't do anything to warrant an attack, but Londa spent the night in jail anyway.

It was only after she made bond that she was able to see a real doctor to get herself the medical attention she needed. And after that the charges were not immediately dropped, causing her to have to pay for a lawyer and get time off work to go to court to address the issues.

I knew I shouldn't have but when she told me what happened in greater detail, I was so shocked that I didn't even check myself. "You know that wouldn't have gone down like that if you were white," just kind of tumbled out of my mouth. I thought she might get angry at such a statement but she looked at me with the eyes of someone who was used to dealing with it and just said "I know, Mikey."

You can say whatever you want about black people not being lynched, hunted by dogs, hit with the fire hose, made to use the "other" bathroom, made to ride at the back of the bus...racism is alive and well in America today. And just because it's not overt enough to be seen on the evening news, just because the morons in white sheets aren't necessarily burning crosses in people's yards, just because you don't want to hear about it Whitey...doesn't mean it isn't there and doesn't mean that it's not having a profound effect on people's lives.

And BTW...not to beat a dead horse, but anyone who thinks that "honky," "cracker," or "whitey" carry even a tenth of the significance that the "N" bomb does or even epithets regarding Jews, Hispanics, Asians, Arabs does is fooling themselves. Well, that or they're just plain idiots.

Thanks for letting me vent.

Late.
__________________


People who use the words "Internet Bullies" are the most pussiest form of pussies you'll ever find. Chances are better than not that any girlfriend they've ever had cheated on them multiple times, probably right in front of them, laughing at their pitiful punk asses the whole time while they sat there and cried. If you or someone you know has been caused grief by an "Internet Bully" then you and/or that person is nothing but a little punk ass bitch, and the world would be a better, more manly place if you'd just jump off a fucking bridge already. Late.
The Glue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15 Jun 2005, 05:35 PM   #2 (permalink)
Master Sergeant
 
The Glue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Pushing toward Visari Square...
Posts: 14,508
Rep Power: 6464
The Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DC
Default

Again I want to stress that that post isn't a shot at Double K. I just happen to have strong issues with the subject, that's all.

Late.
__________________


People who use the words "Internet Bullies" are the most pussiest form of pussies you'll ever find. Chances are better than not that any girlfriend they've ever had cheated on them multiple times, probably right in front of them, laughing at their pitiful punk asses the whole time while they sat there and cried. If you or someone you know has been caused grief by an "Internet Bully" then you and/or that person is nothing but a little punk ass bitch, and the world would be a better, more manly place if you'd just jump off a fucking bridge already. Late.

Last edited by The Glue; 17 Jun 2005 at 03:25 PM.
The Glue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15 Jun 2005, 05:56 PM   #3 (permalink)
Heavyweight
 
Spear's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Taylorville, IL
Posts: 11,017
Rep Power: 2501
Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.
Send a message via MSN to Spear Send a message via Yahoo to Spear
Default

Very nice read, and you know what, your right. Racism is alive and well in this country, we just don't hear about it.

The only problem I have with this thread is this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Glue
The Civil Rights Movement didn't really pick up national momentum until the 60s. The Civil War ended in the 1880s. So it took black people 80 years just to put themselves in a position to affect a change with regard to which freaking bathrooms they could use in public. So try to hazzard a guess as to how far the black population had progressed as far as jobs, wages and housing?? Any realistic guess would suggest that while strides certainly would have been made in that regard, certainly the majority of black people in America were not at all where they should've been in a "Free America."
I don't know if your counting the little skirmishes after that, but the Civil War officially ended in 1865. Just thought you would like to know that.
__________________
Spear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15 Jun 2005, 06:03 PM   #4 (permalink)
Master Sergeant
 
The Glue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Pushing toward Visari Square...
Posts: 14,508
Rep Power: 6464
The Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DC
Default

I hear ya about that Spear. But my understanding of the Civil War is that even after Jefferson Davis surrendered...well, the skirmishes you refer to prolonged everything.

And I'm not 100% but I don't even think South Carolina officially seceeded to the Union, hence jokes about how they're still fighting the Civil War down there.

Late.
__________________


People who use the words "Internet Bullies" are the most pussiest form of pussies you'll ever find. Chances are better than not that any girlfriend they've ever had cheated on them multiple times, probably right in front of them, laughing at their pitiful punk asses the whole time while they sat there and cried. If you or someone you know has been caused grief by an "Internet Bully" then you and/or that person is nothing but a little punk ass bitch, and the world would be a better, more manly place if you'd just jump off a fucking bridge already. Late.
The Glue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15 Jun 2005, 06:12 PM   #5 (permalink)
Heavyweight
 
Spear's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Taylorville, IL
Posts: 11,017
Rep Power: 2501
Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.Spear should cut his own throat and bleed to death.
Send a message via MSN to Spear Send a message via Yahoo to Spear
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Glue
I hear ya about that Spear. But my understanding of the Civil War is that even after Jefferson Davis surrendered...well, the skirmishes you refer to prolonged everything.

And I'm not 100% but I don't even think South Carolina officially seceeded to the Union, hence jokes about how they're still fighting the Civil War down there.

Late.
I think they did. I'm a Civil war buff I guess you could say, but I still don't know a lot about it.
__________________
Spear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15 Jun 2005, 06:17 PM   #6 (permalink)
{~PWF's leading man~}
 
Sly as hell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: {~England~}
Posts: 6,255
Rep Power: 2193
Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.
Default

Very nice read. You know what you're talking about and your eyes are open and i like that.

Did the woman that attacked Londa ever get arrested?
__________________

<select name=which style="font-family: Tempus Sans ITC; font-size: 12pt; background-color: green; font-weight: ; color: orange">
<option>Tap out list</option>
<option>Sam</option>
<option>CDWC (x2)</option>
<option>Blu Angel</option>
<option>BOSTON (x5)</option>
<option>Dan Mavrick</option>
<option>Stephenc97</option>
<option>afficial (x4)</option>
<option>ShyneFactory</option>
<option>Camini</option>
<option>EminemPacPWF</option>
<option>2Gangsta (x2)</option>
<option>StarScream (x2)</option>
<option>Shooter</option>
</select>
Sly as hell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15 Jun 2005, 06:21 PM   #7 (permalink)
Master Sergeant
 
The Glue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Pushing toward Visari Square...
Posts: 14,508
Rep Power: 6464
The Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DC
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sly as hell
Very nice read. You know what you're talking about and your eyes are open and i like that.

Did the woman that attacked Londa ever get arrested?
They were both arrested on scene. Londa was acquitted at arraignment but while they gave her back her bail, she didn't get the $1750 that her lawyer charged her back. She said the other woman got 5 years for assault with a deadly and assault with intent. I never found out what "intent" they charged her with, but 5 years in the hole, 3 years with good behavior...that's about right.

Late.
__________________


People who use the words "Internet Bullies" are the most pussiest form of pussies you'll ever find. Chances are better than not that any girlfriend they've ever had cheated on them multiple times, probably right in front of them, laughing at their pitiful punk asses the whole time while they sat there and cried. If you or someone you know has been caused grief by an "Internet Bully" then you and/or that person is nothing but a little punk ass bitch, and the world would be a better, more manly place if you'd just jump off a fucking bridge already. Late.
The Glue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15 Jun 2005, 06:26 PM   #8 (permalink)
{~PWF's leading man~}
 
Sly as hell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: {~England~}
Posts: 6,255
Rep Power: 2193
Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.Sly as hell is fat like a planet.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Glue
They were both arrested on scene. Londa was acquitted at arraignment but while they gave her back her bail, she didn't get the $1750 that her lawyer charged her back. She said the other woman got 5 years for assault with a deadly and assault with intent. I never found out what "intent" they charged her with, but 5 years in the hole, 3 years with good behavior...that's about right.

Late.
$1750! Damn, thats fucked up. 5 years is nothing really, but atleast she was somewhat punished i guess. Hope Londa is all right though.
__________________

<select name=which style="font-family: Tempus Sans ITC; font-size: 12pt; background-color: green; font-weight: ; color: orange">
<option>Tap out list</option>
<option>Sam</option>
<option>CDWC (x2)</option>
<option>Blu Angel</option>
<option>BOSTON (x5)</option>
<option>Dan Mavrick</option>
<option>Stephenc97</option>
<option>afficial (x4)</option>
<option>ShyneFactory</option>
<option>Camini</option>
<option>EminemPacPWF</option>
<option>2Gangsta (x2)</option>
<option>StarScream (x2)</option>
<option>Shooter</option>
</select>
Sly as hell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15 Jun 2005, 06:32 PM   #9 (permalink)
Master Sergeant
 
The Glue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Pushing toward Visari Square...
Posts: 14,508
Rep Power: 6464
The Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DC
Default

Oh this was a couple years ago. She's great and doing wonderfully for herself. I appreciate the concern on her behalf...she's a dear friend. Yeah, $1750 retainer fee. She was just happy he didn't charge her to show up at the arraignment because his rate was $125 an hour.

Late.
__________________


People who use the words "Internet Bullies" are the most pussiest form of pussies you'll ever find. Chances are better than not that any girlfriend they've ever had cheated on them multiple times, probably right in front of them, laughing at their pitiful punk asses the whole time while they sat there and cried. If you or someone you know has been caused grief by an "Internet Bully" then you and/or that person is nothing but a little punk ass bitch, and the world would be a better, more manly place if you'd just jump off a fucking bridge already. Late.
The Glue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15 Jun 2005, 06:43 PM   #10 (permalink)
No Frills
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: I'm back here
Posts: 6,344
Rep Power: 254
Nick Saban , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Nick Saban , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Nick Saban , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Nick Saban , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Nick Saban , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Nick Saban , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Nick Saban , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Nick Saban , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Nick Saban , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Nick Saban , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Nick Saban , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.
Default

We will never go beyond racism until we quit viewing people as "black", "white", or any other color or politically correct replacement of color.
Nick Saban is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15 Jun 2005, 07:39 PM   #11 (permalink)
Moderator Of Good & Evil
 
The Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Walking upon high, as I step to the edge to see my world below..
Posts: 6,507
Rep Power: 150
The Wanderer , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.The Wanderer , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.The Wanderer , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.The Wanderer , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.The Wanderer , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.The Wanderer , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.The Wanderer , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.The Wanderer , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.The Wanderer , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.The Wanderer , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.The Wanderer , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Popeaux
We will never go beyond racism until we quit viewing people as "black", "white", or any other color or politically correct replacement of color.
Very true. And as it was stated once before, "Theroy of Man, Fear what you cannot conquer, Hate what you do not understand."

BTW well written Glue. I too get that fear racisst crap all the time when I'm just walking down the street, and have women (usually white) watch me unleasly, clutch the purse, or reagard me indirectly like I;m going to rob attack or rape them......get so sick of it at times.
__________________
The Wanderer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15 Jun 2005, 08:19 PM   #12 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Double K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 5,128
Rep Power: 123
Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.
Default

First and foremost, let me say these two things. 1. i do not take anything you said personally, and 2. i am very sorry to hear about your friend for whatever reason she was descriminated against.

ok, so lets talk about racism and slavery, becuase they are so closely related in discussion, but they really shouldnt be taken as one in the same. Slavery is not something that just happened to black folks in the 1800's, slavery has been around for thousands of years, dating all the way back to biblical times, if you believe in the bible , which i do. but what most people dont think about, or know is that through time, there have been many slaves, white, black , asian and whatnot, and believe it or not, many of the black slaves that were shipped overseas from nigeria and sourrounding areas were sold from other black slave owners. yep, people who sold their own people out, doesnt sound like we are far removed from those times, does it?

But on to the times of the civil war, many people think that us "southerners" were just slave drivers, who beat and tortured their slaves and the precious northerners came down here and whipped us and freed all the slaves, but not necessarily, believe this, those same northerners still owned slaves, even up to and after the civil war. In fact, although i am sure slavery was an issue, the confederate states wanted their freedom from the union becuase of the same reason we won our freedom in the revolutionary war. Taxation, higher taxes, and the confederate states didnt want that, but most people think its all becuase of slavery, and although there were overtones on that subject, it wasnt what the civil war was all about. sadly, just like today, much of it was just politics between the north and south.

But the thing is not every slave owner, southern or northern, was the type of owner that hollywood has portrayed in movies like roots, where the slaves were beat senseless all day, and picked cotton when they werent beaten. in fact there are tons of facts that were taken from the slaves who loves their masters, and were treated fairly. sounds bad, but we are talking about different times, so dont think becuase the term "slaves" and "masters" are so frowned upon now that they were so bad.

one quote from a "slave" that i found,

"If you want to ask me about my ancestral roots, I am a Confederate-American. I was born colored, negro, then one day somebody decided to make me African-American. Nobody asked me about that. Africa didn't want me then, and she certainly doesn't want me now."


On slave reparations:

"Our history has been lied about so much starting back in 1865, with the Northern propaganda used to try and drive a wedge between black folks and white folks."

"Reparations is just another lie. I'm not looking for reparations. That's just another way to divide white folks and black folks."


H.K. Edgerton


now lets not say that there certainly were not slave owners who beat their slaves, but again, this is the type of thing that happened to blacks who were slaves in the 1800's, to those jews that were enslaved, beaten and killed by the germans, and back farther to pretty much anyone under the roman armys of old.

But enough about slavery, lets talk about racism. Racism is something that has been around as long as there have been different races, even up to today, its always going to be. from black vs white vs hispanic vs asian vs indian and on and on and on. as i was quoted above as saying i do belive racism exists, there's no denying it and it always will.

But the thing we get so caught up in is pointing the finger at an entire race becuase of a few bad apples. I promise you and there are still white racists out there, there are black racists, and asian and hispanic and so on. But the thing is, like i said, i grew up being taught that black people are my equal, as are every race, and thankfully, although it may have taken a while , for the most part, with hard work and dedication to yourself, any person can recieve scholarships to schools, promotions in jobs, anything. of course there are exceptions, as i keep going back to, because i want to stress that racism will never die.

The thing is (for the most part, as much as i have personally seen in my life in jobs, schools, etc..) the person most dedicated and qualified is the person rewarded, and becuase of things that happened in the past, no person today deserves any more (or less) than what i have based on my level of dedication and hard work, regardless of their race, sex, whatever. The simple fact is that most people today who talk tirelessly about slavery and racism really dont know what slavery was, only what is portrayed on tv , and their views on racism follow closely.

in short, and to be very blunt, which i will aplogize in advance for, i have never been a slave owner, and no one who reads this, im pretty sure has never been a slave, i do not owe you anything, nor do you owe me anything. if you want more , dedicate yourself to getting there, dont dwell on the past, be thankfull for the opportunities you have now.

and as far as the cracker and whitey deal. seriously Glue, if you want to fight racism, then fight it across the board, although Cracker might not be as offending as nigger or spic, it still is an off color comment to white people. who cares if it's less offending, stereotyping is stereotyping, so by all means fight it across the board.

and thanks for reading this, and please dont let this offend you all as well.
Double K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16 Jun 2005, 12:22 PM   #13 (permalink)
CK
Spin Doctor
 
CK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: oHIo
Posts: 17,758
Rep Power: 5407
CK You want to be like DCCK You want to be like DCCK You want to be like DCCK You want to be like DCCK You want to be like DCCK You want to be like DCCK You want to be like DCCK You want to be like DCCK You want to be like DCCK You want to be like DCCK You want to be like DC
Send a message via AIM to CK
Default

Racism will be around until people can start thinking in terms of "white people" "black people" etc.

As long as people still use slurs, racism will be around.

In my life, I have witnessed racism...thru people's comments and actions. We all have. If you really want to do something about racism. The next time you hear someone make a comment or a joke or use a slur...instead of just letting it happen, say something. Inaction is one of the greatest problems in society today. You can whine about shit all you want, but unless you are willing to actually do something about it...you need to shut the hell up.

This isn't really directed at anyone specific, its directed at everyone. All it takes for evil to prosper is for good men to do nothing.
__________________


CK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16 Jun 2005, 01:36 PM   #14 (permalink)
Master Sergeant
 
The Glue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Pushing toward Visari Square...
Posts: 14,508
Rep Power: 6464
The Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DCThe Glue You want to be like DC
Default

Well I can certainly understand and appreciate your point of view. I am of course aware that slavery was not the "key" issue to the Civil War, but there is not really any doubt about the fact that the Civil War did become a symbol of abolishing slavery and the eventual Abolition was a direct result of the Union's victory in that War.

And certainly you and/or I don't personally owe anyone anything in "reparations" for the pre and post Civil War injustices that were inflicted on black people because as you said, neither I, my father or my grandfather were slave owners and certainly there isn't a person alive today who wasn't a slave.

However, my contention is that black people's lives and in many cases their quality of life has been affected and continues to be affected by slavery and segregation, despite those eras being over for decades. A race of people can't just mystically ascend from slavery to the middle class. Likewise, when segregation "ended," it would be a lie to say that black peoples' "integration" (I hate that word but it's the only one I can think of) into American society was seamless.

The Civil Rights movement continued even after the alleged end of segregation because again...there was no hope for a seamless transition. Again, neither you or I personally owe anyone anything with regard to slavery and segregation, but the American society certainly does.

People can talk all they want about how today there is an equal footing and there is no residual effect from those days in our history, but they can't explain the proliferation of minorities in American lower income neighborhoods. Of those two parts of that sentence, if one is true, then it disproves the other...and unfortunately for people wearing blinders, you can argue in favor of the first statement, but we all know the second one is true.

As a society we're getting better. Are we where we should be? No, but it's getting there. Do you owe black people anything for what happened twenty, fourty, a hundred years ago?? No. Does that mean that the travesties that occured are a wash in America today? Absolutely not.

As for "honky,"...I just don't see any significance. It never bothered me, sure there are people who "hate" white people just because they're white, but what the fuck do I care about them? Do I get offended when someone calls me a cracker, whether they mean it or not?? No. Why should I?? I can't recall my parents telling me about marching in the 60's, having dogs sicced on them or getting it with a full blast from a fire hose for wanting to eat lunch at the counter at Woolworth's.

In a lot of cases, minorities view white America as a source of major problems for that. Do I agree with their opinion? No, but I can't fault them for it. Perception is reality and in many cases, their perception, while extreme, can be defended and also in many cases justified. So I do what I can to shape people's opinion of who I am, but I'm not going to fault some black kid who has quite possibly been a victim of racism in the past for calling me a cracker.

I can't recall my grandparents telling me about how their grandparents were slaves. And just because some slave owners may not have been as ruthless as Roots, doesn't really discount the fact that they were slave owners. Regardless of if it was enforced with a smile and a pat on the back or a whip, slavery is slavery and it's not just wrong, it's evil. In light of that, I don't attach any significance whatsoever to words like "honky," "cracker," or any other epithet used for white people.

As I understand it, those words were created by black people to have something to say back to white racists who wouldn't stop calling them n*****s. Whereas that "N" word was universally applied to black slaves and continued to be used regularly throughout the segregationist era and into the 80's. The significance of one isn't nearly the significance of the other, so I attach none to "honky."

Regardless, I can understand your position and I'm glad that the way in which I stated mine didn't offend you.

Late.
__________________


People who use the words "Internet Bullies" are the most pussiest form of pussies you'll ever find. Chances are better than not that any girlfriend they've ever had cheated on them multiple times, probably right in front of them, laughing at their pitiful punk asses the whole time while they sat there and cried. If you or someone you know has been caused grief by an "Internet Bully" then you and/or that person is nothing but a little punk ass bitch, and the world would be a better, more manly place if you'd just jump off a fucking bridge already. Late.
The Glue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16 Jun 2005, 02:13 PM   #15 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Double K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 5,128
Rep Power: 123
Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.Double K , if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Glue

However, my contention is that black people's lives and in many cases their quality of life has been affected and continues to be affected by slavery and segregation, despite those eras being over for decades.

Again, neither you or I personally owe anyone anything with regard to slavery and segregation, but the American society certainly does.

Late.

i think in terms of taking time to build from low income to middle class income, i am sure becuase many black people were not given the same educational opportunities from the civil war times up until the breaking points of segregation, i can see why you would say there are lasting effects, and perhaps this is where i might fail to understand partially from where i live, becuase i dont see any really large , for lack of a better term "ghetto" type areas or low income areas that are predominantly black. In fact in my area, (around the Charlotte, NC area) the really low income areas are predominantly hispanic, and there are lots of middle class blacks, as well as whites. ( im not stating that there are no black low income areas but that any black person in my area has the same opportunity as me to grow )

I could understand how the american society might owe some sort of reparations to those blacks that were affected directly by segregation, but again in my area, all i see when i hear someone speaking of racism steeming from slavery is just people who really have no idea what slavery was, who have never had to sit outside of a place that refuses service to blacks, they only know what they are taught, and most times that is from hollywood and that is sad.

now, someone can correct me if i am wrong, and maybe i live in the minority of the nation where black people have all the same rights that white people do (minus of course the occasional racist pig, which is everywhere) but i think it's time to move on, accept the leaps and bounds that this nation has taken in the past 30 years, and realize that we are very fortunant people to be masters of our own destiny.

lastly to clear up to anyone please let me say in my earlier post i was not in any way trying to clean up slavery as being ok or "right". i was only trying to state how it has been twisted and changed over time to seem as though it was only about beating people and working their fingers to the bone and so forth. i was NOT condoning slavery in any way, i apologize to anyone who may have taken it that way.
Double K is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Wow, We think racism is bad here. Oeo Sports 2 10 Dec 2004 10:59 PM
New Scholarship For Whites Only error402 Meeting Of The Minds 10 27 Feb 2004 10:18 PM
Racism in the WWE. STICK World Wrestling Entertainment 22 27 Jun 2003 04:47 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:09 AM.

Attribution:
Powered by Yahoo Answers



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2 © 2011, Crawlability, Inc.