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If Public Schools Aren't Good Enough For The Teacher's Kids...
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Old 23 Sep 2004, 05:39 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default If Public Schools Aren't Good Enough For The Teacher's Kids...

Let's say that you suggest going to a local restaurant, but a friend of yours says he has heard that people who work there won't eat the food or let their families eat the food. Do you still go to that restaurant or do you go somewhere else?

Suppose you need to get your car worked on. Would you take your car to a shop if you knew that the people who worked there took their own cars somewhere else and told their kids to do the same?

What if we were talking about a hospital. Would you want to have an operation done at a hospital if the doctors and nurses who worked there sent their own kids somewhere else when they were sick? Of course you wouldn't, because if the people who work there feel that way, obviously there is some sort of problem.

Keeping all of that in mind, read this....

Quote:
"More than 25 percent of public school teachers in Washington and Baltimore send their children to private schools, a new study reports.

Nationwide, public school teachers are almost twice as likely as other parents to choose private schools for their own children, the study by the Thomas B. Fordham Institute found. More than 1 in 5 public school teachers said their children attend private schools.

In Washington (28 percent), Baltimore (35 percent) and 16 other major cities, the figure is more than 1 in 4. In some cities, nearly half of the children of public school teachers have abandoned public schools.

In Philadelphia, 44 percent of the teachers put their children in private schools; in Cincinnati, 41 percent; Chicago, 39 percent; Rochester, N.Y., 38 percent. The same trends showed up in the San Francisco-Oakland area, where 34 percent of public school teachers chose private schools for their children; 33 percent in New York City and New Jersey suburbs; and 29 percent in Milwaukee and New Orleans.

..."Across the states, 12.2 percent of all families — urban, rural and suburban — send their children to private schools," says the report, based on 2000 census data.

"Public education in many of our large cities is broken," the surveyors conclude. "The fix? Choice, in part, to be sure."

Public school teachers in Philadelphia, Cincinnati, Chicago, Rochester, N.Y., and Baltimore registered the most dissatisfaction with the schools in which they teach.

"These results do not surprise most practicing teachers to whom we speak," say report authors Denis P. Doyle, founder of a school improvement company, SchoolNet Inc.; Brian Diepold, an economics graduate student at American University; and David A. DeSchryver, editor of the Doyle Report, an online education policy and technology journal."
39% of the teachers in Chicago send their kids to private school? 41% in Cincinnati? 44% in Philly? Come on, what does that tell you about the quality of education that the students are getting in these schools when the teachers who work there would rather pay big bucks to a private school than have their kids get a free public education?

Tell ya what, school teachers always complain about being underpaid, so why don't we help them -- and all the other parents out there -- with school vouchers? It'll give parents much more of a choice about where to send their kids to school, it'll mean competition that will lead to an improved education, and we're spending the money anyway, right? Every American should at least be able to send their child to a school that's good enough for the teacher's kids and school vouchers can help make that possible.

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Old 23 Sep 2004, 07:19 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Somehow, you've neglected the stupidest and for that matter poorest state in the US. Is there a suspicious smiley?
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Old 23 Sep 2004, 10:21 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Trev you answered your own question. Its mainly the steady decline of lack of funding most public schools have in the last decade why most people are avoiding public schools now...which is very sad..things aren't that much better for public schools here too.
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Old 24 Sep 2004, 09:37 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Public schooling has been decaying for the last 10 years. But it's not only the goverment's fault, we have to blame parents alike for this. What is the main problems on schools other than poor school equipment, serious lack of funding? Violence. In the past five years school violence has hiked so bad that some parents decide to send their kids to private schools. It is sad thou. I was raised on public schools but most of them were respectable schools.
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Old 26 Sep 2004, 08:50 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Wanderer
Trev you answered your own question. Its mainly the steady decline of lack of funding most public schools have in the last decade why most people are avoiding public schools now...which is very sad..things aren't that much better for public schools here too.
aaarrrrrggggghhhh. Funding for public education is at an all time high and has been increasing for many years. I allready own this argument.

Committee on Education and the Workforce

Highlights...
The problems in America’s schools are clearly not the result of a lack of spending.

Education continues to be the most heavily supported of all federal programs.

While federal spending overall has increased by 40 percent since 1997, education spending has increased by nearly 90 percent during that time.

Since Republicans became the majority in Congress, education has been the top funding priority. Since FY 1996, the first fiscal year with a Republican Congress, education spending has increased by 118 percent – nearly two and a half times the increase for the Defense Department during the same time period.

At the federal, state, and local level combined, America spends more for K-12 education than it does for defense. And if you count spending on higher education, vocational training, special education, and other educational programs, the amount the nation spends is more than twice the entire defense budget.
---

Money isn't the problem. Teachers and administrations are to blame.
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Old 27 Sep 2004, 12:47 AM   #6 (permalink)
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heh exo please tell me where is that money?

My wife works in a school and so far funding is a big issue. In case you have forgotten school funding comes from property taxes, state budget and federal grants. Right now here in texas (President Bush's backyard) there is a serious lack of funding for schools. Budgets have been scattered unequally and a program called the robin hood program was around to take money from schools who have a bigger budget and give to other schools. This might sound good but it's unconstitutional so the state HAS to figure out a better budget system. And Florida's school system is not as bad as Texas but some school districts don't have money for books etc.

You can't say school funding has grown specially since the Bush administration cut 400 million dollars on after school programs, vocational education and another program called impact aid to create a private school voucher scheme. Even our president decided to cut funding on schools to help the private schools. The same ones you guys are mad at cause the teachers sent their kids there.

I don't see where that increase on educational spending is. All I hear on schools is that funding is not enought, no money for schools materials, teachers being seriously underpaid even on the private schools. How can we provide a better future for our kids when the goverment no matter what administration is in power does not spend the money they promise. it is sad thou that our kids are simply being "left behind" Hence the irony on that
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Old 27 Sep 2004, 03:56 AM   #7 (permalink)
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The problem with public schools is a misappropriation of funds. A more active interest needs to be placed in the youh of America.
We must make sure the money for schools is going to the right places, and we must make sure that the right people are placed in the right positions. If we make sure that a teacher has all the tools they need to teach a class yet their students continue to underperform...then obviously that teacher is not cut out for the job. They need to be replaced with someone who can cut it.
I find it hard to place a price on the value of a good education...as a country our prioritization of education is frighteningly low. Our student teacher ratios are too high. Our teachers are underpaid. Our parents do not take an active interest in our childrens education. There are many flaws in the system.
Sooner or later the buck must stop. People must start recognizing their own need to take responsibility for the next generation. We have to make sure that the teachers have what they need in the classroom. We have to make sure that the students are getting what they need in the classroom...and at home. Education is not the sole responsibility of the teacher.


sidenote: Trev....a lot of people who work in restaraunts won't eat where they work. Once you see how something is prepared...it kinda kills it for you.
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Old 27 Sep 2004, 09:15 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Yeah Kurt is right. Not even the people who work on a auto shop like pep boys etc have a tendency of not to take their cars where they go. I think it's just a bad habit we all have.
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Old 27 Sep 2004, 09:41 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Ok I went to a Private School all my life. I have my kids in a public school. I feel there isnt a whole lot of differnce in the education you get its in what you pay. Of course I went to a Baptist school and the course of study was centered around the Bible. So therefore at least the School my kids go to is fine. Now if i were in a big city and there were not enough teachers and to many kids in a class i could see the decline in the learning. So that being the case i could see the teachers sending their kids to a private school, since there arent as many children per teacher.
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Old 27 Sep 2004, 10:59 PM   #10 (permalink)
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These guys are right Exo, Teachers are FAR from teh problem..hell most teachers nowadays are some of the most underated and under aprecated workers in education to date. Alot of my friends are teachers now, some in public school, many in private schools and i've heard of fthe horror stories on what piblice school teachers have to put up with, disorganized programs, insuffensent time for class perparation, over crowded classes, constant extra circular activites cut, dated and in some cases outated equipment and textbooks, increased violence in schools (not just student to student but to teachers as well) the list goes on and on which is why many are in the private school sectior, and thats not even including the intial pay.

Also if the schools are so well payed, why is it so much of the money that is neeeded in major problem areas, hardly get get a trickle when these payments hit their depts? Its the same set of problems i hear all the time both here in Canada and the US. And to think I could be a part of this public education system in a couple of years.....
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Old 29 Sep 2004, 12:51 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Teachers are part of the problem. Teachers are more disinterested now than ever. They have that retarded tenure program and it hides and protects them. Teachers need to be held just as accountable as anything else for the decline in education. The teachers unions have hijacked public education. There is more money now than ever, but, money isn't the problem. There's plenty of it. It just never gets to the schools. That's not a funding problem, that's a structural and administrative problem. But please, don't ever think it's Bush's lack of funding, because that's simply not the case. Teachers and school systems need to be held accountable, parents need to be held accountable and students need to be held accountable.

But that's my whole point, it's not a money problem.
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Old 29 Sep 2004, 01:06 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by exo
Teachers are part of the problem. Teachers are more disinterested now than ever. They have that retarded tenure program and it hides and protects them. Teachers need to be held just as accountable as anything else for the decline in education. The teachers unions have hijacked public education. There is more money now than ever, but, money isn't the problem. There's plenty of it. It just never gets to the schools. That's not a funding problem, that's a structural and administrative problem. But please, don't ever think it's Bush's lack of funding, because that's simply not the case. Teachers and school systems need to be held accountable, parents need to be held accountable and students need to be held accountable.

But that's my whole point, it's not a money problem.
Thats pretty much the point I was trying to make.The money is there, its just not getting where it needs to be. I suppose I just am looking at it from a slightly different angle. The teachers who arent performing need to be replaced, the ones that are IMO need to be compensated.

Placing all the blame on teachers isnt exactly fair. In school I spent about 5 hrs a week with any one of my teachers. Parents need to take an interest in their childrens education.



Both Bush and Kerry actually have a pretty good stance on education btw...

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Old 29 Sep 2004, 01:33 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurt Angle
Both Bush and Kerry actually have a pretty god stance on education btw...
Yeah. The only thing I disapprove about Bush's education plan is the tests they take. That system is used here in Texas and it's calles the TAAS. Really problematic and not effcient. Everything else is fine and dandy with me.

And administration has a tendency of taking a big chunk of money. A schol superintendent has an average salary of 220K a year. I think thats too much for someone who sits on his ass all day signing papers and making the wrong desicions.
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