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Should America Change it's Two Party System?
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Old 18 Sep 2004, 10:39 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Should America Change it's Two Party System?

Personally, I think it should.

Are Americans satisfied with just having Democrat and Republican figures run our political system? Should we reform our government? How many parties do you think we should be able to choose from, and would you change the law on the Electoral College?

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Old 18 Sep 2004, 10:51 PM   #2 (permalink)
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No and no.

There are several other parties that put up people for elections. You can't just throw government money into them, and that is essentially what a change in the so called two party system would do. The other parties just have to make their points as loudly as possible....like that could ever happen.

The Electoral College is just fine. It's worked this many times with the population all but twice that I'm aware of. Considering how crucial (pshhh...yeah right) the decision of who to elect President is, we shouldn't take representative government out of that because they are really some of the only Americans that are actually qualified to make a distinction as to who'd be a better president. Politicians often have their heads up their asses and that is true...but the founding fathers put it there for a reason.

Late.
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Old 18 Sep 2004, 10:53 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Now I dont profess to knowing exactly how you us government works but I know from experience over here that if you have more than 2 choices you end up with a situation where no-one has the sufficient seats to impliment any changes because they dont have enough votes to pass programs or laws and then they have to rely on compromises to get things passed and thats not always the best solution to problems especially how some parties have agendas that they want to look after.
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Old 18 Sep 2004, 11:10 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Those where both really beneficial replies, thanks for the input.

However, I still think something needs to be done to improve our selection for president. I have contemplated on the issue of increasing the Presidents salary from $450,000 a year to $1,500,000. Perhaps if there were a better salary offered, higher numbers of intelligent people would apply for the position.

But I have just contemplated this, what do you think?
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Old 18 Sep 2004, 11:10 PM   #5 (permalink)
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^That happens in some local elections. In SF, they have a one party system, where nobody can ever get enough votes to win, so there are tie breakers and runoffs all the time. It's retarded. The reason 3rd parties don't really do well, is because they're so specific in what their platform is, that most ppl just don't sympathize or identify with them.
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Old 18 Sep 2004, 11:12 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by SavageYoda
I have contemplated on the issue of increasing the Presidents salary from $450,000 a year to $1,500,000. Perhaps if there were a better salary offered, higher numbers of intelligent people would apply for the position.
c'mon, like an oil tycoon and a slice of white bread married to a bajillionaire are worried about their salary? Arnold donated his salary back to the state.
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Old 18 Sep 2004, 11:13 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by The Glue
. Politicians often have their heads up their asses and that is true...but the founding fathers put it there for a reason.

Late.
It was a compromise. Some wanted Congress to make this decision while others wanted direct voting. Although now it serves another purpose: it levels the playing field. Without it they would only go in the big states because the little states would be about 50,000 (this is how many would actually vote in an unpopulated state) out of millions. Now they mean a minimum of 3 out of 535 which gives states with smaller states some relevance.

The 2 party system is not put into place by any law or any other government sanction. People decide which parties have any power by voting for those candidates. The founding fathers were actually against parties. They had 2 but they were horribly unorganized. They were based soley on one issue, whether or not they should have a powerful federal or state government.
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Old 18 Sep 2004, 11:13 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Im not certain if thats even high enough to persuade top level minds to apply.

The smartest minds normally fill the executive positions on big corporations and Im certain that they earn way more than $1500000/year.
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Old 18 Sep 2004, 11:16 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by exo
^That happens in some local elections. In SF, they have a one party system, where nobody can ever get enough votes to win, so there are tie breakers and runoffs all the time. It's retarded. The reason 3rd parties don't really do well, is because they're so specific in what their platform is, that most ppl just don't sympathize or identify with them.
Rather similar to Louisiana. Our senate campaign 2 years ago had 4 Democrats and 5 Republicans (no exageration) Our runoff had 2 women from New Orleans running so for once the graveyard vote was split.
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Old 18 Sep 2004, 11:20 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Rather similar to Louisiana. Our senate campaign 2 years ago had 4 Democrats and 5 Republicans (no exageration) Our runoff had 2 women from New Orleans running so for once the graveyard vote was split.
yeah, that's similar to the california recall, which had 2 republicans and a democrat. Peter Camejo(sp?)(who I think is a real life communist) was a green party candidate and Arianna Huffypuffy was trying to get the Dem vote. If I remember correctly, she dropped out like 2 days before the election.

but whatever the case was, there was a lot of fear that Arnold wouldn't get enough votes on a split republican ticket. Even if more ppl voted for a republican candidate. It was pecular. Trev prolly remembers or knows more about it than me though, if anyone really cares
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Old 18 Sep 2004, 11:52 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by exo
c'mon, like an oil tycoon and a slice of white bread married to a bajillionaire are worried about their salary? Arnold donated his salary back to the state.
I don't know, I just see it as a better incentive. For all the scrutiny a president has to put up with over any other politician, I think it would be worth it. I know some highly intelligent people that don't pull a million-five annually. I know some that quadruple that. But in this day and age, $450,000 ain't shit. IMO


Quote:
Originally Posted by exo
c'mon, like an oil tycoon and a slice of white bread married to a bajillionaire are worried about their salary? Arnold donated his salary back to the state.
FYI, "If my memory serves me correctly" with out searching, I heard these numbers about a month ago on what the four Candidates are worth, their net value.

Kerry = Billionaire, married into his wealth.
Edwards = 72 million, earned by suing medical practices.
Cheney = 54 million, CEO for Halliburton.
Bush = 34 million, son of a President & oil stocks.

Thank God for Arnold, even though I didn't vote for him, I'm thankful for his stewardship. He has made great changes for our state and is helping on turning around the states economy in leaps and bounds. He just wanted California to be the great state he he knew it once was. Davis, "whom I voted for twice" really fucked up our state. I voted for his recall, but I did not vote for Arnold.
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Old 19 Sep 2004, 05:08 AM   #12 (permalink)
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I don't know about having more than 2 parties...tho I would like to see some party and campaign reform.

For example, Attack ads should not be permitted. The way the system curently works, you almost learn more about a candidate from their opponents commercials. I would like to see a focus placed more on addressing the issues pertinent to that election. I would also like to see a prohibition placed on mentioning and attacking your opposition in your political ads. I want the candidates to tell me why I should vote for them, not why I should vote agaisnt the other guy.

Also, I think in an effort to increase voter turn out, and to encourage young people to vote. The parties should make themselves more accessible. Make their views and positions more clear...less double talk. I truly think that is a big reason for poor turnout on elecion day...many young voters just have no idea what the hell candidates are talking about. Flip Flopping, Double Talking, Crazy Jibba Jabba fools are not generally very clear on things.

Anywas...just my opinion...feel free to ignore me
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Old 19 Sep 2004, 05:12 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Hey kurt.........we have a solution for the voting turnout problem. Make it compulsory for anyone over the age of 18 to vote. Anyone here that doesnt gets a fine sent out to there house.

As for the negative ads........we at the moment have a candidate that promises not to follow the actions of the other and making a negative ad during this campain, he said his focus would only be on anouncing and defending his policys for government if hes elected.........Ill let you know how that turns out. LOL
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Old 19 Sep 2004, 05:24 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shane
Hey kurt.........we have a solution for the voting turnout problem. Make it compulsory for anyone over the age of 18 to vote. Anyone here that doesnt gets a fine sent out to there house.
I don't know that fining people is the way to go...If someone is voting out of obligation then you are gonna get a bunch of uniformed voters....that does no good. I'd rather see more of an emphasis placed on educating young people....getting them familiar with what the different parties stand for...

maybe a class taught in Junior/Senior Year of Highschool...but then I suppose that people would complain its too left wing, its too right wing...blah blah blah

The best answer is probably to have the parties themselves take more of an interest in getting young people to understand their views and turn out at election time. Stop trying to be hip...it aint working. Explain to us what you stand for...and why you deserve our votes.
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Old 19 Sep 2004, 05:38 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurt Angle
I don't know that fining people is the way to go...If someone is voting out of obligation then you are gonna get a bunch of uniformed voters....that does no good. I'd rather see more of an emphasis placed on educating young people....getting them familiar with what the different parties stand for...
I offer a reason why its good.

We have a lot of people that waste that vote with an informal vote (a wasted vote by people either protesting or just being ass clowns) but by making it compulsory you have the chance to make people care about there vote as opposed to trying to encourage someone to want to vote. They are already going there and while you will have that percentage of uninformed voters you mentioned that will make there uninformed choice you only have to convince a fraction of those people to care and you begin helping make the system better.

All of the polling booths here will have people armed with how to vote properly and they also try and sell there parties position while they are at it and even though they get ignored by a lot of people you only have to have a few sucesses here and there with the uninformed people for compulsory voting to be successful.
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