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Randy Savage: Living in Hogan's shadow.....
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Old 03 Mar 2004, 10:38 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Randy Savage: Living in Hogan's shadow.....

the Macho Man, oooohhhhh yyyeeeeaahhhh!.....

Savage, well respected by smarks on most occasions, long lived in the unmistakable shadow of the phenomenon that was Hulkamania.....he never could get over the hump of being second fiddle to Hogan, even when he was the champion.....

so, was Savage the unfortunate soldier who had to live in Hogan's shadow or was he raised to higher levels as a result of Hogan's power in the wrestling world?.....

would he have been the Macho Man without Hulkamania running wild?.....

giveth witheth theeth responseseth......thank you.....
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Old 04 Mar 2004, 02:37 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Well alot of smarks claimed that what Vince did to Hogan, he could've done it with any guy(Mach's name being tossed), but I would say w/o the Hulkster, he would'nt have achieved the success he once has. It was Hogan who brought him into the industry b/c of them being friends for a long time. So I would say Hogan's partially the reason why Savage had so much success.
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Old 04 Mar 2004, 06:41 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundgarden420
Well alot of smarks claimed that what Vince did to Hogan, he could've done it with any guy(Mach's name being tossed), but I would say w/o the Hulkster, he would'nt have achieved the success he once has. It was Hogan who brought him into the industry b/c of them being friends for a long time. So I would say Hogan's partially the reason why Savage had so much success.
I don't understand what this post means. Are you suggesting that it was Hogan that got Savage into the industry of Wrestling?

Hogan was influencial backstage. But Savage won wrestler of the Year in 88' and Savage won most popular wrestler of the year in 88' not Hogan. It was the mega-power gimmick that brought this popularity to a head. But that was there back at Mania 3 when Savage and Steamboat were fueding over the IC title. Savage was huge back then before being a contender for the World title. I don't think that I ever heard a crowd give the responce that they use to give Savage as a womanizing heel. Even so he was the true tweener of the WWF in the days of him as a heel. And his match's were always above average. The man inside of the ring made you believe what he was doing, and his ring psychology was second to nones. As far as Savage being huge without Hogan, I would say that it really didn't matter. As Savage was a huge addition to the WWF when he came over from AWA and was the most saught after wrestler in the company. He was gonna be world champ regardless of whether Hulkamania was around or not. As we saw when he became Worlc Champ for the second time. As far as him being the Macho Man.....Well he was The Macho Man loooong before he steped foot into WWF. And he was the Macho Man looooong after he left the WWF.......Savage isn't in Hogans shadow. Someone like Owen Hart is in Bret Shadow, because Owen only recived success when it had something to do with Bret. Savage had success before during and after Hogan. But I will say the Mega Powers was a huge draw and elivated Savage even further in his career, which at the time was in his prime. Another thing is Hogan looked his best against Savage. Randy made Hogan have a match better then anyone I can think of. Counting Mutoh, Flair, Sting, Hennig and a boat load of others. I think it goes both ways. with these two but Hulk is diffenently a bigger name. However Savage isn't behind anyones shadow
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Old 05 Mar 2004, 10:51 AM   #4 (permalink)
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However Savage isn't behind anyones shadow
okay, I'll take the differing side on this one.....

Macho Man, while winning most popular wrestler awards and wrestler of the year awards, never appeared on the cover of Sports Illustrated.....he never appeared on the cover of TV Guide.....he held the WWF title for a period of time that Hogan needed Hulkamania to refuel, and his most popular title reign was during a feud with Hogan.....his most notable title reign was the IC title.....

Savage still uses Hogan's name to gain recognition, as is evidenced by him calling out Hogan on his CD.....Randy Savage could never overcome Hogan's popularity, his politics and his fan base.....

Savage lives in the shadow of Hulkamania, and he would not be the Icon that he is without Hogan......
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Old 05 Mar 2004, 11:33 AM   #5 (permalink)
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By that same theory I could say Bruno Samartino lives in the shadow of Hogan. Its not about who gets to do the most stuff outside wrestling. Its who can attrack and substain a fan base during wrestling. Savage did that long before Hogan and long after Hogan. Him calling Hogan out and telling him to be a man, is no different if Sting called Ric Flair out. Nemesis are Savage/Hogan and Sting/Flair. They both sets had some of the best match's ever with each other. Like I said before Savage's first world title regin had Hogan all over it. But people weren't charing for Savage because of Hogan. People were doing that long before Hogan and Savage teamed up. Simular to the responce Cena got when he was a heel but the crowd liked him. Saying Savage wouldn't be the Icon he is today without Hulkimania is like saying Ric Flair wouldn't be the man he is today without Harley Race. Of course thats true. You need another person to make history with. Just like Hogan and Andre. The same with Savage and Hogan. Hogan wouldn't have been the icon he is today had someone like Big John Studd been the first guy in WWF to slam him. The fact that Savage could cut a better promo then Hogan, wrestle a better match then Hogan, and brought out the best in Hogan, makes me believe that Savage also did a lot for Hogan in his career. No fued is better then the Mega Powers. No story of Icon friendship is better then the Mega Powers. Nash/HBK...doesn't hold a candle to the story of the mega powers. You forget Hogan turned on the Mega Powers to form the NWO. There is a historic component in the story that Hogan and Savage had. And while I will say that Hogan was the top man Savage was always the corner stone. One because Hogan cold captivate a crowd and then wrestle a okay match. Savage could do the same but not to the same extent. However Savage can wrestle a perfect match. And Savage has always been a better all around wrestler then Hogan. Not to mention watching 5 Savage match's back to back and watching 5 Hogan match's back to back is sooo different. Savage owns Hogan inside the ring. And that is something no one can take away from him. This Shadow you speak of applies to every wrestler except the Rock, if you want to go on Hollywood press.
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Old 05 Mar 2004, 01:01 PM   #6 (permalink)
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well, your theory is valid, but I still disagree to an extent.....

Hogan would have been Hogan without Savage.....Savage wouldn't have been Savage without Hogan, and a couple of things you said bear that point out.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dre
Hogan could captivate a crowd and then wrestle a okay match. Savage could do the same but not to the same extent. However Savage can wrestle a perfect match.
Hogan was the indomitable force.....yes, you need two to make history, or do you?.....Hogan's legend sort of grew with the bodyslam of Andre, but would his legend be any less if he had not slammed the Giant?.....probably not.....and remember, Hogan remade himself when the time came to do it.....he still gets the big pops today because he was able to become a super heel and then return to face.....If Savage were to have changed back to a heel, it wouldn't have been received as easily, imo.....

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Savage owns Hogan inside the ring.
I can't argue that point at all.....no one can.....however......

I say that Savage could have just as easily been replaced in Hogan's history by someone like Mr. Perfect.....whereas, without Hogan, Savage would be in the same place historically as Mr. Perfect is now (if that didn't make sense, I apologize).....

I'd like to get someone else's take on it, though.....
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Old 06 Mar 2004, 08:45 AM   #7 (permalink)
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In A Sense, Savage Was In Hogan's Shadow For A Exteneded Period Of Time And He Seemed To Escape It Only To Come Crashing Back In It In WCW. Every Wrestler In The 80's Was Second Fiddle Compared To Hulk Hogan, It Didn't Matter What Skills They Possessed, That Was A Fact. How Many Came From AWA With A Substantial Fan Base, Hennig, DiBiase, Rude, Savage. But They Always Played Second Fiddle To Hogan.

In A Sense, I Agree With OEO Cause Savage Could Have Definitely Become A Bigger Star, Perhaps Had He Been Given The Ball And Allowed To Run With It, Things Would Have Changed. We All Know Hogan Was Always In The Preverbial Main Event Picture Even When Hogan Was Champ, Which Brings Me To The Mega Powers.

The Mega Powers On The Other Hand Was Such A Fuckin' Waste Of A Year In The WWF It Was Unbelievable. Yes Sure, It Was A Great Feud. Fans Like Me Ate It Up Cause We All Both Loved Hogan And Savage. But Really, From Mania' IV To Mania' V, It Took A Whole Year To Build Up The Eventual Breakup Because Of Miss Elizabeth. This Did More To Hurt Savage Then It Did To Help Him In The Eventual Long Run. Because This Feud Will Always Tie His Name To Hogan, And It Will Always Piss Me Right The Fuck Off (Although That Has Notin' To Do With The Argument). It Took A Whole Year And The Fuckin' WWF Title To Create This Feud.

Before You Give Me The "That Was WWF Back In The Day, Takin' Their Time To Create A Great Feud," Had They Simply Let Mach Have A Run On His Own, This Definitely Would Have Helped Out The WWF So Much More. Savage Always Had The Better Skills In The Ring, Hogan And Him Were Pretty Up To Snuff Promo Wise. But Think Of All The Fuckin' Feuds That Could Have Occurred Had Savage Been Able To Run With The Ball. DiBiase, Hennig, Rude, Jake The Snake When He Was Heel (Though We Got It Years Later). I Mean Think Of The Fuckin' Memorable Matches That Could Have Occurred And Think Of How Different Mania' V Would Be. Instead We Had Fuckin' Hogan And Savage For A WHOLE Fuckin' Year And It Resulted In A Shitty Ass Match. Lookin' Back One Year, I Guess It Would Have Been Naive To Allow Macho To Run With The Ball, Cause Hogan Would Have Always Been There.

This Would Have Been A Perfect Time To Give The Belt With A Heel And Experiment, Cause Savage Doesn't Lose Any Credibility Where As If Hogan Sold A Punch He'd Lose .09% Of His Fan Base Everytime. Savage Could Have Easily Won The Belt Back At Mania' V And They Still Had A Shitload Of Time To Create The Ultimate Challenge.

But I Will Give Macho Man Credit, He Was Buried At Wrestlemania VI With The Fat Yellow Polka Dot Bitch, But Where Hogan Could Not Evolve And Come Back Stronger, Mach Did And Ended Up Havin' The Best Match At Mania' VII With Warrior Where Hogan Couldn't. The Next Year Once Again Savage Got The Better End With His Match With Flair While Hogan Was Caught Up In A Crap Ass Feud With Sid.

Then Savage Followed Hogan To WCW And Started The Cycle I Thought He Had Broken.
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Old 06 Mar 2004, 02:04 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Nice Slash.

In a way it depends on how you look at it. I always thought Savage was better inside of the ring, and could deliver the best promos in the business. Exspecially when he was the IC Champ. But if you wanna get real deep about it then you have to say that Hogan wasn't gonna allow somone to take the spot light for a long time, while he was employed in WWF. So its not like anyone back there had bigger pull to say what to do and who shold run with what on the wrestler side then Hogan. You couldn't even make reference to his bald spot in promos so, obviously he wasn't gonna let Savage outshine him. Hogan knew that if Savage was allowed to run with the ball the Madness would have been endless. The fueds that Savage could have had with some of the guys in WWF at that time would have been tryuly historic.
And while Hogan was champ and Savage was battlig Dusty Rhodes and a stupid woman, Savage still made the storyline and match good.

oeo,

Hogan would not have had so many rememoriable moments if not for Savage. People remember Hogan slamming Andre. People remember Hogan losing the title and the forming of the Mega Powers. People remember the Hogan/Savage match. People remember Hogan/Warroir match.........................And then it gets real silient and then bam people remember Hogan in WCW. All that time in between though no one ever talkes about; Hogan/Yoko, Hogan/Bossman, Hogan/Earthquake, Hogan/Poffo. No one ever talks about the Hogan/Slaughter match. No one talks about Hogan again until Savage enters WCW and the Mega Powers are reformed. Then no one remembers anything about Hogan again until he turns on Savage and forms the NWO. Then people talk about the NWO, and no one makes a big deal until Nash and Savage turn on the NWO and form the Wolf Pac. You see people might want to say Savage wasn't as big as Hogan. And I will agree that Savage isn't a bigger name then Hogan, but Whenever something historic happend surrounding Hogan Savage has always been apart of it for the most part.

And then look at it from a 'wrestling' and not 'entertainment' fan. Savage brought the best out in Hogan. Best match in Hogans life imo. Hogan/Flair no where near as good as Savage/Flair. Hogan/Warroir a classic match but not nearly as good in any way shape or form when compaired to Savage/Warrior. Warroirs best match ever imo also. One of the greatest psychological match's in the history of wrestling went down between Savage and Roberts. Hogan can never have a match that damn good. One of the best matchs Yoko ever had was with Savage. Better then his match with Hart. Savage has proven himself to be in no mans shadow. Now he might not have made it as big as Hogan did. but then again he wasn't the top guy of the promotion as Hogan had been in that posistion for some time. He liked being the face and so that is why when he did turn heel again with NWO it was such an impact

As for saying that Hogan would have been as big if not slaming Andre. I don't think so. That was the biggest point in his career. Sure he beat the Skeek for the title a few years before. but up until slamming Andre, Hulk would have gone down in wrestling for his fueds with Orndorff and Piper.......
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